Identify Tribal Town Citizens So We Know Who's Who
Especially those who are in decision-making positions in our Muscogee (Creek) Nation. We would like to know where their loyalties lie.
Many say they should renounce their tribal towns and join the MCN or renounce MCN and go away. Having dual citizenship creates problems for us all.
We comment on double-dipping because of the status given them, yet they claim they are considered 2nd Class citizens.
(VOC: Folks, please stay within the TOPIC & subject. Veering off too far.)
Many say they should renounce their tribal towns and join the MCN or renounce MCN and go away. Having dual citizenship creates problems for us all.
We comment on double-dipping because of the status given them, yet they claim they are considered 2nd Class citizens.
(VOC: Folks, please stay within the TOPIC & subject. Veering off too far.)
Thank you voices of courage for putting this on the website. We really do have double dipping here at Mvskoke Nation,,first of all when the other nations became Sovereign nations they left the Mvskoke Nation. PERIOD.When Kialegee got their recognition from the Federal Government they ceased to be partners with Mvskoke nation. Washington 1942, when Thlopthlocco got their soverinity in in 1938 they cease to be partners with Mvskoke nation.Sec 3 says "Any person who is adopted shall relinquish his membership other other Indian Tribe or band,other than the Creek nation of Indians of Oklahoma, before adoption into this town.Kialegee constitution and by-laws does not recognize the Mvskoke Nation at all.
If you are a member of any of these Nations you do not need to be on our council or run for office at our community offices and getting our food and services,,,If you are 1/4th wantabe you are not indian,.,Duh!!
Reply to this
i agree that if they are recognized by the feds as a sovereign nation they should not be allowed to hold an elected office in another tribe. i have heard of the double dipping for years and i thought that if you had a membership card from one tribe you could not get one from another. i am supposing that the tribes citizenship boards do not communicate with one another thus the fallacy. i do not agree on the 1/4 blood not being an Indian though. as the saying goes we don't choose our mothers or fathers. i have met and know of many 1/4 or less bloods that know more of our tribe and it's culture than many of us who are directly involved with the tribe. i am a full blood but i agree with our forefathers in that we need the knowledge and involvement of the white man simply because this is their world and to get along or advance in it we must adhere or assimilate to the white mans ways. the good ones anyway.
Reply to this
When CN became federally recognized in 1979,it stated u can belong 2 a tribal town. Did u not put ur tribal town on ur application when u enrolled 4 citizenship? The 3 Tribal Towns do not double dip. They haves much rights to be Creeks as u. They were federally recognized in 1940's not in 1979
Reply to this
Someone better double check the Creek Constitution.
Reply to this
When the 3 Tribal Towns became federally recognized, they did not cease to be Creek Nation, they were Creek Nation just like the other 41 Tribal Towns. Read up on ur History of Creek Nation
Reply to this
Correction there were 48 tribal towns that existed at the time of Oklahoma statehood...
The Creek Nation Census of 1891 had the following population figures for the 48 respective Creek Tribal town units....
l. Coweta - 593
2. Broken Arrow (Thlikachka) - 431
3. Cheyah (Chiaha) - 154
4. Lockarpoka (Tulsa-Arkansas) - 194
5. Chonchartey (Concharty) - 194
6. Hechetey (Hitchitee) - 182
7. Cussehta (Cusseta) - 434
8. Taskeka (Tuskegee) - 401
9. Tulsa (Canadian) - 140
10. Tulsa (Little River) - 360
11. Noyarka (Nuyarka) - 237
12. Alafaske (Okfuskee-Canadian) - 136
13. Arbekoche - 73
14. Arbeka - North Fork - 132
15. Arbeka - Deep Fork - 141
16. Asselaraapeor Granlief (Ussalarnuppee)[Greenleaf] - 109
17. Oewohka (Wewoka) - 102
18. Tharthoculka (Fish Pond) - 160
19. Tharprakko (Thlopthlocco) - 334
20. Tokebachee (Tuckabatchee) - 785
21. Thewahley (Thlewarle) - 196
22. Kialiga (Kialigee) - 246
23. Tokpafka (Tookparfka) - 92
24. Talmochassee (Talmochussee) - 86
25. Yoofula (Eufaula-Canadian) - 236
26. Yoofula (Eufaula-Deep Fork) - 133
27. Pakantalahassee (Pukkon Tullahassee) - 102
28. Hillabe (Hillabee) - 109
29. Chartaksofka -
30. Kichopatake (Kechopatarky) - 391
31. Artussee - 150
32. Tallahossochee (Tullahassochee) - 59
33. Allabama (Alabama) - 171
34. Wewogufke - 185
35. Osochee - 87
36. Oeokofke (Wewoka) - 102
37. Okeharya (Okchiye) - 212
38. Ocheyapo a (Ochiapofa)[Hickory Ground] - 331
39. Talwathakko (Tulwa Thlocco) - 171
40. Talartoga (Talledaga) - 159
41. Hutschechapa (Hutche Chappa) - 196
42. Quassartey (Koasata) No. l - 79
43. Quassartey No. 2 - 48
44. Yoachee (Euchee) - 580
45. Big Spring (Wekiwa Thlocco) - 180
46. Arkansas (Colored) - 1,970
47. North Fork (Colored) - 789
48. Canadian (Colored) - l,444
The above article was published in the Tulsa Annals, vol. XXXI, no. 3 of 3, Summer, 1996, pp. 9-13.
Reply to this
MVTO, to Eli Grayson for taking the time to post this insightful information ! Wish more Tribal Members
would be considerate enough of other members, if even to only assist them with information.
With respect to these people that "claim they are considered 2nd Class citizens":
1. Who considers them to be 2nd Class Citizens ?
2. If they are getting benefits from 2 Tribes, then maybe all MCN Tribal Members should find another Tribe to
have dual citizenship with; so that they can 'claim they are considered 2nd Class citizens while they
'double-dip' and receive the benefits that they have been & continue to be, wrongfully & unjustly denied.
3. When do the people that have been denying the MCN Tribal Members their 'just do' as Tribal Members, become
held accountable for their mistreatment of Mvskoke Peoples ?
4. When will we, as the MCN Tribe, be a tribe in Spirit as well as Name ?
5. How many examples of how we have NOT been taken care of by others, do we need to learn from ?
6. Why did The Great Spirit place us here first, if not to show the way to others ?
7. Why are people so sure that Jesus did NOT have Red Skin....?
Reply to this
Hello, thanks four your post, but I am an elder and when I go to get my commodities and all the fresh fruit and vegetables are gone and I am told the other nations come over here and rape our commodiity building and gets all the food I get angry not for my salf but for the other Elders of the Mvskoke Nation> We now have a member of Kialege nation that is the Chairperson of OIC and does not give us full information where our money is going and she will not step down because the Community Development has no authority to do anything it is disgusting to see people setting at the desk without authority.
Mvskoke Nation will not give the Sovereign Nations back their nations membership because we want to continue to get monoey because of the,,I do not care about the food I care about my other elders.Who go to bed hungary,,and recently one of the Elders wants to have two meals a day and I will see just why we do not get two meals a day for the Elders, I am a talker and a doer for the Elders,I got the vans for the communities and the phones for the Elders and took a bus to Macon Georgia with 48 elders, We went to Florida,Georgia,HoorseShoeBend and I was presented the key to Tuckabatchee by the Mayor of Tuckabatchee..I hope you know who I am NOW!!
Reply to this
I would like to comment on two things: I don't think there is double dipping in the CN commodity program, I would think the program personnel is at fault, isn't there a check and balance system in place? I think you need to question the Director in charge and not point that finger and call it fact. And how was your trip to Georgia funded? With money from the CN, money that should have benefited the whole community not just a few chosen. and I know who you are.
Reply to this
i am old but not an elder but i do eat two meals a day and still work for a living. i do eat two meals a day but can't afford to go on trips like that. must be nice. you are right about the double dippers if they want to be a separate tribe then stay separate.
Reply to this
To the person who wanted two meals a day I did go to the nation and asked for two meals a day and the reply was there was not enough money in the budget for two meals a day. I did go and pick up my commodities and since
JF at second chief's office got involved we got more today than we ever have,,Thanks JF
Reply to this
thank you wotko70 for bringing these inequities to everyones attention. It is clear from your previous post that you have suffered many injustices from housing, social services, the Okmulgee Indian Community and many other programs that were run by the previous administration. I agree with you that there are too many wannabe creeks that don't understand the needs of citizens like your self, who deserve to be at the top of the list(s) of services provided by both the Federal government, State of Oklahoma and Muscogee Nation. Just like the old agency system that from your age, your are probly very familiar with.
You should be proud that you have friends in high places such as JF(aka Jeff Fife) to help you. Please continue to share your insight and wisdom with us.
Reply to this
I get commodities and the store is always stocked, I am also an elder and they have always sacked my food up and carried it to my car. I don't gripe becuse all the commodity we get, it's free. some people is just not satisfied with what they get, i am thankful i get all this food and i don't pay a cent for it. i wish the people was more thankful for this program and the food we receive. it's just like a real grocery store.
Reply to this
Kialegee is not a tribal town, neither is Thlopthlocco,Alabama,the are sovereign Nations.And should be able to feed,house their citizens.We have citizens from Thloptlocco that has gotten a home and other services from our nation. Which means who ever was a Creek had to wait another year for services and homes.I hope the Micco of Thlopthlocco Nation can now come and get his members of off Creek Nation Roll and hope the NC member from Thlopthlocco can step down from the NC as he is not a member of Creek nation.
Reply to this
No it is not free,we gave Mississippi and Georgia and Alabama our land for this food, you must be a wantabee Creek.
Reply to this
Who the hell would Wanna be Creek!!!!
Reply to this
All tribal towns in the 1930's through the 40's had the opportunity to become federally recognized but chose not to. As we went into the 1970's, Claude Cox along the Bureau of Indian Affairs put the tribal town under MCN. To unravel all of this the tribal towns would need a good attorney to begin in the 1930's with the Acts Of Congress during that time and bring it up to the 1970's and come forward to today. The older generation of national council people knew what I am speaking of.
Reply to this
Doesn't the Harjo case nullify the assumption that tribal towns share a jurisdiction with the Naton? I haven't read it in a while but it establishes the Creek Nation as the surviving government of the old country. The fact that the tribal towns have been somewhat subservient to the Nation points to that. Also, all 48 tribal town don't have the same jurisdiction just like all three of the current ones and the Nation shouldn't share a jurisdiction.
Reply to this
Dang, there sure is a lot of NDN on NDN hating going on up in here. Looks like to me a lot of skins in here are jealous cause they didnt take the time to find out what tribal town they belong to or just dont care. Either way NDN up and stop the hate.
Reply to this
AMEN!
Reply to this
I support tribal towns for they are what has made Muscogee Nation unique within itself. I believe Tiger (George) is for supporting the old ways before they are gone and forgoten. But I also believe that Muscogee Nation should have some kind of authority in helping organizing these tribal towns goverment structures. Of all three tribal towns Kialegee has always tried to keep them selves on the outs...most likely due to the fact that its mainly 1 BIG FAMILY that tries to control the whole tribal town and thats how they want to keep it. Another thing I would like to point out is comments made on Kialegees behalf of how "Traditional" they are and how they carry on they old way....Quick History>>> Tribal Towns produced daughter fires...and if at any time that fire/medicine was no longer active they join thier mother fire...Kialegee produce 2 daughter fires but only one (Hutchechuppa) along with Kialegee made it over from East. Hutchechuppa lost its fire in the early 1900's therefore joining with thier mother fire (Kialegee)...but during the time of organizing KTT in the 1930's-40's certain names and family group were removed from the original listing of Tribal Town members and still to day Kialegee will tell you that Hutchechuppa is a seperate tribal town and NOT part of Kialegee..WOW and thats Tradition...sounds more like WHITE GREED...the smaller they keep thier tribal town the more money that 1 family can get. Muscogee Nation needs to go in and restructure Kialegee like they did Thloplocco....or Kialegee needs to change thier name to HOBIA TRIBAL TOWN because they do NOT represent ALL Hutchechuppa and Kialegee people.
Reply to this
That is the same at Thlopthlocco also, one family owns the town. I wish they would quit coming to our community meetings and participating in community gatherings!!
Reply to this